Ask A Question on the daf

Previous daf

1) ONE WHO SELLS TO ONE WHO OWES HIM MONEY

(a) (Mishnah): Reuven produces a document saying that Shimon owes him money; Shimon shows a document that Reuven sold him a field.
(b) Admon: Shimon can say - if I owed you money, you should have kept the money as repayment, and not sold me a field!
(c) Chachamim: Reuven was clever to sell him land - he will now be able to collect his debt!
(d) (Gemara) Question: Admon's law is reasonable - why do Chachamim's argue?
(e) Answer: In a place where people pay for a field before the document is written, all agree that Shimon can say - if I owed you money, you should have kept the money as repayment.

1. They argue in a place where people pay for a field after the document is written.

i. Admon holds, Reuven should have told witnesses why he is selling.
ii. Chachamim say, everyone has friends - had Reuven done this, Shimon would have heard and would not have bought the field.

(a) (Mishnah): Reuven shows a document saying that Shimon borrowed from him; Shimon shows a document that Reuven subsequently borrowed from him. Admon says, Shimon can claim - if I truly owed you money, why did you borrow from me - you should have collected the debt!
(b) Chachamim say, each collects what the other owes him.
(c) (Gemara): Reuven and Shimon both show documents saying that the other borrowed from him.

1. (Rav Nachman): Each collects what is owed to him.
2. (Rav Sheshes): There is no point in paying money and returning it - rather, each keeps his own.

(d) All agree, if Reuven and Shimon have the same quality land (both Idis, or both Beinonis, or both Ziburis), each keeps what he has.
(e) They argue when one has Beinonis and the other has Ziburis.

1. Rav Nachman holds, each collects, because he says that a creditor collects from what is Beinonis (middle quality land) of the borrower.

i. The one with Ziburis receives the Beinonis of the other; he then pays with his Ziburis. (He need not return the Beinonis he received, since it is Idis to him).

2. Rav Sheshes holds, each keeps his property, because he says Beinonis is measured objectively.

i. If he would collect Beinonis, he would have to return it.

(f) Question: According to Rav Nachman, why does the owner of the Ziburis collect first?

1. We should let the owner of the Beinonis first collect Ziburis, and he can then return the Ziburis!

(g) Answer: The case is, the owner of the Ziburis was the first to demand payment.
(h) Objection: But still, they come to collect at the same time!
(i) Retraction: Rather, they argue when one has Idis and Beinonis, and the other has Ziburis.

1. Rav Nachman holds, a creditor collects from what is Beinonis of the borrower; Rav Sheshes holds Beinonis is measured objectively.

(j) Question (against Rav Sheshes - Mishnah): Chachamim say, each collects ...
(k) Answer #1 (Rav Nachman on behalf of Rav Sheshes): The case is, one loan was for 10 years, the other for 5 years.

1. Question: When were the loans made?

i. Suggestion: If the 1st was for 10 years, and the 2nd for 5 - why would Admon say that he should have collected his loan - the collection time didn't come yet!

2. Answer: Rather, the 1st loan was for 5 years, and the 2nd for 10.
3. Question: When was the 2nd loan made?

i. Suggestion: If the 1st loan was already due to be collected - Chachamim should agree to Admon, if he really owed him, he should have collected the loan!
ii. Suggestion: If the 1st loan was not yet due to be collected - why does Admon say he should have collected it?

4. Answer: The case is, the 2nd loan was made on the day the 1st loan was due,

i. Chachamim hold, a person would take a loan for 1 day (i.e. rather than wait to collect his loan at the end of the day); Admon holds, a person would not take a loan for 1 day.

(l) Answer #2 (Rami Bar Chama): The case is, one party died, leaving no land.

1. His orphans collect, but a creditor cannot collect from them.

(m) Objection: The Mishnah says, each side collects!
(n) Answer: It means, this one collects, and this one is fitting to collect.
(o) Objection #1 (Rava): Firstly, the Mishnah says they each collects!
(p) Objection #2 (Rava): Secondly, the other party can pay land, and collect it again!

1. (Rav Nachman): If orphans collect land for a debt owed to their father, a creditor of the father can collect that land.
2. These are left difficult.

(q) Suggestion: We should establish the Mishnah that orphans have Ziburis, and the other party has (Idis and) Beinonis; the orphans collect Beinonis, and pay back Ziburis!

1. Even if Beinonis is defined objectively - only Ziburis is collected from orphans!

(r) Rejection: That is only when the creditor has not seized Beinonis; when he has seized Beinonis, he keeps it.

(a) (Mishnah): There are 3 regions (of Eretz Yisrael) regarding marriage: Yehudah, east of the Yarden, and Galil. One cannot force his wife to move to a different region.
(b) Within a region: one can force his wife to move from one city to another, or from a large city to another large city;

(c) One cannot force his wife to move from a city to a big city, or vice-versa;
(d) One can force his wife to move from a bad place to a nice place, but not from a nice place to a bad place; R. Shimon Ben Gamliel says, one cannot force her even from a bad place to a nice place, because living in a nice place checks (causes sickness).
(e) (Gemara): We understand, one cannot force his wife to move from a big city to a city - everything is found in a big city, but not in a city.
(f) Question: Why can't he force her to move from a city to a big city?
(g) Answer: As R. Yosi Bar Chanina taught.

1. (R. Yosi Bar Chanina): Dwelling in a large city is hard - "They blessed all the people that volunteered to live in Yerushalayim."

(h) (Mishnah): R. Shimon Ben Gamliel says ...
(i) Question: What does it mean, checks?
(j) Answer: As Shmuel taught.

1. (Shmuel): Change in one's routine brings stomach sickness.

(k) (Ben Sira): All days of a poor person are hard.
(l) Question: Shabbos and Yom Tov are enjoyable!
(m) Answer: As Shmuel taught - a change in one's routine is the start of stomach sickness.
(n) (Ben Sira): Even nights (of a poor person are hard) - his roof is lowest of the roofs, his vineyard is at the top of the hill.

1. Rain from other roofs falls on his; the soil of his vineyard falls to others.

(a) (Mishnah): Anyone can force (his household) to move to Eretz Yisrael; he cannot force them to leave Eretz Yisrael; anyone can force (his household) to move to Yerushalayim; he cannot force them to leave Yerushalayim - this applies to men and women equally.
(b) If a man married a woman in Eretz Yisrael, and divorced her in Eretz Yisrael, he pays the Kesuvah in coins of Eretz Yisrael; if he married her in Eretz Yisrael, and divorced her in Kaputkiya, he pays the Kesuvah in coins of Eretz Yisrael;
(c) If he married her in Kaputkiya, and divorced her in Eretz Yisrael, he pays the Kesuvah in coins of Eretz Yisrael; R. Shimon Ben Gamliel says, in coins of Kaputkiya;
(d) If he married her in Kaputkiya, and divorced her in Kaputkiya, he pays the Kesuvah in coins of Kaputkiya;;
(e) (Gemara) Question: 'Anyone can force' - what does this come to include?
(f) Answer: To include slaves.

1. Question: According to the opinion that the Mishnah explicitly lists slaves - what does it include?
2. Answer: Even from a nice place to a bad place.

(g) Question: 'He cannot force them to leave' - what does this come to include?
(h) Answer: To include slaves.

1. Question: According to the opinion that the Mishnah explicitly lists slaves - what does it include?
2. Answer: A slave that fled from Chutz la'Aretz to Eretz Yisrael.

i. The master must sell the slave to one who lives in Eretz Yisrael, to promote settlement of Eretz Yisrael.

(i) Question: 'Anyone can force to move to Yerushalayim' - what does this come to include?
(j) Answer: Even from a nice place to a bad place.
(k) Question: 'He cannot force them to leave' - what does this come to include?
(l) Answer: Even from a bad place to a nice place.

1. Since the beginning of the Mishnah taught, 'He cannot force them to leave', the end also taught this.

(m) (Beraisa): If he wants to go to Eretz Yisrael, and his wife does not - she must go, or else he may divorce her without paying her Kesuvah; if she wants to go to Eretz Yisrael, and he does not - he must go, or else he must divorce her and pay her Kesuvah;
(n) If she wants to leave Eretz Yisrael, and he does not - she must stay, or else he may divorce her without paying her Kesuvah; if he wants to leave Eretz Yisrael, and she does not - he must stay, or else he must divorce her and pay her Kesuvah.
(o) (Mishnah): If he married a woman ...
(p) Question: The Mishnah contradicts itself!

1. If he married her in Eretz Yisrael, and divorced her in Kaputkiya, he pays the Kesuvah in coins of Eretz Yisrael - we see, he pays according to the place where he obligated himself.
2. If he married her in Kaputkiya, and divorced her in Eretz Yisrael, he pays the Kesuvah in coins of Eretz Yisrael - we see, he pays according to the place where she collects!

(q) Answer (Rabah): The Tana holds that Kesuvah is mid'Rabanan - therefore, he is lenient to allow payment of the smaller coins.
(r) (Mishnah): R. Shimon Ben Gamliel says, in coins of Kaputkiya.

1. He holds, Kesuvah is mid'Oraisa.

(a) (Beraisa): If a loan document says (that it was written in) Bavel, it must be paid in coins of Bavel; if it says Eretz Yisrael, it must be paid in coins of Eretz Yisrael;

1. If the place is not written - it is paid in coins of the place of collection.

(b) If it only says 'silver' - the borrower pays him whatever he wants.

1. This does not apply to a Kesuvah.

(c) Question: Which law does not apply to a Kesuvah?
(d) Answer (Rav Mesharshiya): The first law (that it is paid in the coins of the place it was written) - the Tana does not hold as R. Shimon Ben Gamliel (rather, the smaller coins are paid).
(e) (Beraisa): If it only says 'silver' - the borrower pays him whatever he wants.
(f) Question: Why not say, he pays him chunks of silver?
(g) Answer (R. Elazar): The case is, the document says 'silver coins'.
(h) Question: Why can't he pay him Prutos?
(i) Answer (Rav Papa): No one makes silver Prutos.

(a) (Beraisa): A person should live in Eretz Yisrael, even in a city which is mostly Nochrim; he should not live in Chutz la'Aretz, even in a city which is mostly Yisrael.

1. This is because anyone that lives in Eretz Yisrael is as one that has Hash-m over him, but anyone that lives in Chutz la'Aretz is as one that does not have Hash-m over him, as it says, "To give you Eretz Kana'an, to be to you as Hash-m".

(b) Question: Anyone that does not live in Eretz Yisrael is as one that does not have Hash-m over him?!
(c) Answer: Rather, anyone that lives in Chutz la'Aretz is as one that serves idolatry.

1. Question: "I was expelled from (Eretz Yisrael) ... they told me, go serve idolatry" - did someone really tell David to serve idolatry?!
2. Answer: Rather, this teaches that anyone that lives in Chutz la'Aretz is as one that serves idolatry.

(d) R. Zeira wanted to go to Eretz Yisrael, so he was avoiding Rav Yehudah.

1. (Rav Yehudah): Anyone that goes from Bavel to Eretz Yisrael transgresses a Chayavei Aseh - "They were taken to Bavel, and there they will be until I redeem them".