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Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld
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Horayos 5
HORAYOS 5 - Today's Daf has been dedicated by Rabbi Dr. Eli and Jeri Turkel,
of Ra'anana Israel, in honor of the births of the new grandchildren, Yisrael
Yehonatan (to Tamar and Netanel Casado) and Avigayil Zahava (to Limor and
Chaim Turkel).
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1) HOW MANY "PARIM" ARE BROUGHT?
(a) (Mishnah - R. Meir): If Beis Din ruled mistakenly and the
majority of Yisrael sinned, Beis Din brings a Par; if
they transgressed idolatry, they bring a Par and a Sa'ir;
1. R. Yehudah says, they bring 12 Parim; for idolatry,
they bring 12 Parim and 12 Se'irim;
2. R. Shimon says, 13 Parim; for idolatry, 13 Parim and
13 Se'irim, one for each Shevet, and one for Beis
Din.
(b) R. Meir says, if Beis Din ruled and (the majority of each
of) seven Shevatim sinned, Beis Din brings a Par; for
idolatry, they bring a Par and a Sa'ir;
1. R. Yehudah says, each Shevet that sinned brings a
Par by itself; also, every other Shevet brings a Par
on account of the Shevatim that sinned;
2. R. Shimon says, eight Parim are brought (each Shevet
that sinned brings one, and one for Beis Din); for
idolatry, eight Parim and eight Se'irim are brought.
(c) R. Yehudah says, if the Sanhedrin of a Shevet ruled and
that Shevet sinned, that Shevet brings a Par; the other
Shevatim are exempt;
1. Chachamim say, Parim are only brought for rulings of
the great Sanhedrin - "Im Kol Adas Yisrael Yishgu",
not the Sanhedrin of one Shevet.
(d) (Gemara - Beraisa): Beis Din knows that they erred, (and
that most of Yisrael transgressed two sins, one on
account of Beis Din, one b'Shogeg), they do not remember
which of the two was on account of the Hora'ah. One might
have thought that they are liable - "And *the* sin became
known", (they must know what they permitted), it is not
enough to know that the majority sinned.
1. R. Yehudah says, "That they sinned" - if two
Shevatim sinned, they bring two Parim; if three
Shevatim sinned, they bring three Parim.
2. Suggestion: Perhaps this teaches that if two or
three individuals sinned, they bring two or three
Parim!
3. Rejection: "Ha'Kahal" - the Kahal (all of Yisrael)
is liable, and each Kahal (Shevet) is liable.
i. If two Shevatim sinned, they bring two Parim;
if seven Shevatim sinned, each brings a Par,
and every other Shevet also brings a Par;
ii. "Ha'Kahal...ha'Kahal" teaches that each Shevet
brings.
4. R. Shimon says, the seven Shevatim that sinned bring
seven Parim, and Beis Din brings one Par.
i. We learn a Gezerah Shavah "Edah-Edah" from the
sin - just as the sin involved Beis Din and the
Tzibur, also the Korbanos.
5. R. Meir says, Beis Din brings one Par for the seven
Shevatim that sinned, and the Shevatim are exempt.
i. We learn a Gezerah Shavah "Edah-Edah" from the
Hora'ah - just as the Hora'ah was by Beis Din
alone, also the Korban.
6. R. Shimon ben Elazar cites R. Meir to say, if six
Shevatim sinned comprising the majority of Yisrael,
or seven Shevatim even if this is the minority, Beis
Din brings a Par.
(e) Question: The Beraisa says, '"And *the* sin became
known", not just that they know that the majority sinned'
- like whom is this?
(f) Answer #1 (Rav Yehudah): It is unlike R. Eliezer.
1. (Mishnah - R. Eliezer): If a person is unsure
whether he ate Chelev or Nosar (a Korban after the
permitted time to eat it,) no matter which he ate,
he must bring a Chatas!
(g) Answer #2 (Rav Ashi): It can even be like R. Eliezer - it
says (regarding Hora'ah) "That they sinned *in it*" (Beis
Din must know the mistake).
(h) Question: Also regarding a Chatas, it says "That he
sinned *in it*"!
(i) Answer: That teaches that Misasek (one who sinned without
even intending to do the action) is exempt (if he did not
benefit).
(j) Question: What is R. Yehudah's reason (that even the
Shevatim that did not sin bring Parim)?
(k) Answer: He expounds the following four laws from
"Ha'Kahal...ha'Kahal" (the two words, and the two letters
'Hei'):
1. Each Shevet is liable; (Parim are brought only when)
Beis Din give a Hora'ah, and the people
transgressed; Shevatim that didn't sin bring on
account of those that sinned; a Shevet that sinned
by following its Beis Din is liable.
(l) R. Shimon does not expound one of the letters 'Hei' (in
"Me'Einei *ha*'Kahal", the Torah merely speaks as people
do), he expounds two words and one 'Hei':
1. One teaches that each Shevet is liable; the other
two are used for the Gezerah Shavah (just as both
Beis Din and the Tzibur were involved in the sin,
they both bring Korbanos).
(m) R. Meir does not expound either 'Hei'; he only learns a
Gezerah Shavah - just as the Hora'ah was by Beis Din
alone, also the Korban.
(n) Question: What is R. Shimon ben Elazar's reason?
(o) Answer: "Im *me'Einei* ha'Edah" - this implies, even from
the minority;
1. Contradiction: It also says "*All* the nation
forgot" - this implies, the majority!
2. Resolution: If six Shevatim sin, if they are the
majority of Yisrael, Beis Din brings a Par; if seven
Shevatim sin, even if they are the minority, a Par
is brought.
5b---------------------------------------5b
(p) Question: How do R. Shimon and R. Meir learn that (Parim
are brought only when) the Hora'ah comes from Beis Din,
and the people transgress?
(q) Answer #1 (Abaye): "Im me'Einei ha'Edah Ne'es'sah
li'Shgagah".
(r) Answer #2 (Rava): "The whole nation, bi'Shgagah".
(s) We need both verses.
1. If we only had the first verse, one might have
thought that a Par is brought even if the minority
sinned;
2. If we only had the second verse, one might have
thought that a Par is brought only if Beis Din also
sinned.
(t) Question: These verses are written regarding idolatry!
(u) Answer: We learn a Gezerah Shavah "Me'Einei-Me'Einei"
from idolatry to other transgressions.
2) "HORA'AH" OF THE BEIS DIN OF A "SHEVET"
(a) (Mishnah): If the Beis Din of a Shevet ruled...
(b) Question: According to R. Yehudah - if one Shevet sinned
by following the great Sanhedrin, do the other Shevatim
also bring Parim?
1. Only when seven Shevatim sin, the others bring, for
the majority sinned;
2. Or, the others bring in any case?
(c) Answer #1 (Beraisa): They bring one Par;
1. R. Shimon says, they bring two Parim.
2. Question: What is the case?
i. If seven Shevatim sinned - R. Shimon says that
eight Parim are brought!
3. Answer: Rather, one Shevet sinned.
4. Question: How did it sin?
i. Suggestion: If by following a Hora'ah of its
own Beis Din - R. Shimon says that Parim are
not brought for this!
5. Answer: Rather, it followed the great Sanhedrin.
6. Question: Who is the first Tana?
i. It is not R. Meir, he exempts unless the
majority of Yisrael sins!
7. Answer: Rather, it is R. Yehudah.
(d) Rejection: No - the case is, six Shevatim sinned,
comprising the majority of Yisrael; the first Tana is R.
Shimon ben Elazar.
1. (Beraisa - R. Shimon ben Elazar, citing R. Meir): If
six Shevatim sinned comprising the majority of
Yisrael, or seven Shevatim even if this is the
minority, Beis Din brings a Par.
(e) Answer #2 (Beraisa - R. Yehudah): If a Shevet sinned by
following a Hora'ah of its own Beis Din, only that Shevet
brings; if it sinned by following the great Sanhedrin,
the other Shevatim also bring.
(f) (Rav Ashi): We may also derive this from our Mishnah!
1. (Mishnah): If a Shevet sinned by following its Beis
Din, that Shevet brings, the other Shevatim are
exempt.
2. Question: By saying 'that Shevet brings', we know
that the other Shevatim are exempt!
3. Answer: The extra words teach that the other
Shevatim are exempt only when the Hora'ah was from
Beis Din of a Shevet, but for a Hora'ah of the great
Sanhedrin, they bring.
3) WHEN ONE "SHEVET" SINS
(a) Question: According to R. Shimon, if one Shevet sinned by
following the Great Sanhedrin, what is the law?
(b) Answer #1 (Beraisa): They bring one Par;
1. R. Shimon says, two Parim.
2. Question: What is the case?
i. Suggestion: If seven Shevatim sinned - R.
Shimon says that eight Parim are brought!
3. Answer: Rather, one Shevet sinned.
4. Question: How did it sin?
i. Suggestion: If it followed a Hora'ah of its own
Beis Din - R. Shimon says that Parim are not
brought for this!
5. Answer: Rather, it followed the great Sanhedrin.
6. Objection: This cannot be - the first Tana is unlike
any Tana we know!
i. It is not R. Meir, he obligates a Par only when
the majority sins!
ii. It is not R. Yehudah, he says that all the
Shevatim bring!
7. Answer: It is R. Shimon ben Elazar, like the above
Beraisa.
(c) Answer #2 (Mishnah - Chachamim): Parim are brought only
for rulings of the great Sanhedrin.
1. Question: Like which Tana do Chachamim hold?
i. They do not hold like R. Meir, he obligates
only when the majority sins!
2. Answer: Rather, they hold like R. Shimon.
(d) Question: How do R. Yehudah and R. Shimon learn that one
Shevet is considered a Kahal?
(e) Answer #1: "...In the Kahal of Yehudah and
Yerushalayim...the new Chatzer".
1. Question: Why is it called new?
2. Answer (R. Yochanan): They made a new decree, that a
Tvul Yom (one who immersed and is not fully Tahor
until evening) may not enter Machaneh Leviyah.
(f) Objection (Rav Acha bar Yakov): Perhaps one Shevet alone
is not called a Kahal - part of Yerushalayim belongs to
Shevet Binyamin!
(g) Answer #2 (Rav Acha bar Yakov): "(Hash-m told Yakov)...I
will make you a Kahal of nations".
1. Binyamin was the only Shevet born after this - this
shows that Binyamin is considered a Kahal!
(h) Question (Rav Sheva): Perhaps (the family of) Yakov will
first become a Kahal when Binyamin is born!
(i) Answer (Rav Kahana): If so, even 11 Shevatim are not
considered a Kahal (but "The Kahal of Yehudah" teaches
that even two Shevatim are called a Kahal)!
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