Ask A Question on the daf

Previous daf

1) IS ONE WHO TAKES AND RETURNS SOMETHING RESPONSIBLE?

(a) Answer #3 (Abaye bar Avin and R. Chanina bar Avin): The case is, Shimon took the flask to measure (the oil for Reuven) with it.

1. (Rabah): An animal was lost; a Chacham (who is exempt from returning it, it is beneath his dignity) hit it (to make it return by itself) - he is responsible to return it.

(b) Objection: Rabah said that regarding an animal - once it strays, it is less likely to return home;

1. We have no source that using a flask (for the sake of Reuven) obligates him to return it to Reuven!

(c) Answer #4 (Rava and R. Zeira): The case is, Shimon took the flask to measure with it for others.

1. R. Yehudah holds that one who borrows without permission is like a borrower, it suffices to return it to where he took it from (the child);
2. Chachamim hold that one who borrows without permission is like a robber, he must return it to the owner.

(d) (Shmuel): If one takes a vessel from a craftsman to see if he wants to buy it, and Ones occurred, he is liable.

1. This is only if the price is known.

(e) Levi entered a meat store; he picked up thigh to inspect it. A horseman came and took it; Rav Yemar obligated Levi to pay;

1. This is only because the price was known.

(f) Reuven brought gourds to Fum Nahara to sell; everyone took one each (intending to buy it; he thought they were stealing). He said 'They are Hekdesh'!

1. Rav Kahana: A person cannot make Hekdesh something that is not his (the buyers acquired, they merely owe money).
2. This is only if the price is known - if not, they still belonged to Reuven, they are now Hekdesh.

(g) (Beraisa): If Shimon (who is trustworthy about Ma'aseros) was looking at vegetables to buy them (from Reuven, who is not trustworthy about Ma'aseros), even for a whole day, he does not acquire (until he decides absolutely), he need not tithe them;

1. If he decided to buy them, he acquires, he must tithe them.
2. If he later decides to return them, he must first Ma'aser them; Shimon (gives the Ma'aser to a Levi and) pays Reuven the value of the Ma'aser, and returns the remaining vegetables.

(h) Question: Because he decided to buy them, he acquires and must tithe them?!
(i) Answer (R. Hoshaya): The Beraisa discusses a Heaven-fearing person, like Rav Safra, who fulfilled "V'Dover Emes bi'Lvavo" (he fulfilled his intention, even though he did not say a word).

(a) (Mishnah): A wholesaler cleans his measures once every 30 days (because they are used often, much sticks to them);
(b) A regular person (who sells less frequently) cleans his measures once every 12 months;
(c) R. Shimon ben Gamliel says, just the contrary (a wholesaler's vessels are used often, the remaining drops usually do not dry up and stick to the vessels, once a year suffices, for a regular person, once every 30 days).
(d) A grocer cleans his measures twice a week, his weights once a week, and his scale after every weighing.
(e) R. Shimon ben Gamliel says, this applies to (vessels that hold) liquids; for dry things, there is no need to clean the vessels.

3) GIVING EXTRA

(a) The grocer must give enough produce to Machri'a (lift the pan holding the weights) a Tefach (above the produce).
(b) If he (is in a place where one) measures evenly, he compensates by adding extra produce: one part for 10 for liquids, one for 20 for solids.
(c) In a place where people measure with small vessels, he should not measure with big vessels (for there will be fewer weighings);

1. In a place where people measure with big vessels, he should not measure with small vessels (the seller cannot make them so even).

(d) In a place where people sell even measures, he should not give a heaping measure, or vice-versa (we will explain why).
(e) (Gemara) Question: What is the source (that one must make the weights go a Tefach higher)?
(f) Answer (Reish Lakish): "Even Shelemah va'Tzedek" - give more than the full measure.
(g) Question: But the next clause teaches 'in a place where people measure evenly, he compensates by adding extra' - if the Torah requires Hachra'ah, how can he weigh evenly?
(h) Answer: Really, the Torah does not require Hachra'ah (but where people do so, one must Machri'a a Tefach);

1. The question was, what is the source that 'in a place where people measure evenly, he compensates by adding extra'? Reish Lakish answered, "Even Shelemah va'Tzedek".

(i) Question: How much extra must one give (what does it mean one part for 10)?
(j) Answer (R. Aba bar Mamal): A tenth of a liter for a sale of 10 liters (i.e. one part in 100) regarding liquids.
(k) (Mishnah): One part for 10 for liquids, one for 20 for solids.
(l) Question: What does this mean?

1. Does it mean, a tenth of a liter for a sale of 10 liters for liquids, one part in 20 of a liter for a sale of 20 liters for solids?
2. Or, does it mean, a tenth of a liter for a sale of 10 liters for liquids, or for a sale of 20 liters for solids?
3. This question is not resolved.

(a) (R. Levi): The punishment for false measures is more severe than for incest - regarding false measures it says "El", regarding incest it says "Eleh".
(b) Question: What is the source that "El" connotes strength?
(c) Answer: "V'Es Elei ha'Aretz Lakach".
(d) Question: Regarding incest it says "Eleh", which also connotes severity!
(e) Answer: No, "Eleh" comes to teach that Kares (applies to Arayos, it) does not apply to false measures.
(f) Question: Since Kares applies to Arayos but not to false measures, why are false measures considered more stringent?
(g) Answer: One can repent after sinning with Arayos, not after sinning with false measures.
(h) (R. Levi): The punishment for stealing from a person is worse than for stealing from Hekdesh.

1. Regarding stealing from a person, the Torah says "Chet", before (he benefited, i.e.) "Me'ilah"; regarding stealing from Hekdesh, it does not say "Chet" until after "Me'ilah".

(i) (R. Levi): Hash-m acts unlike people: Hash-m blessed Yisrael with 22 letters (from Aleph to Tav - "Im Bechukosai Telechu...Komemiyus") and cursed them with eight (from Vov to Mem, "V'Im Bechukosai Tim'asu...Ga'alah Nafsham")

1. Moshe blessed Yisrael with eight letters "V'Hayah Im Shamo'a...l'Avdam" and cursed them with 22 - "V'Hayah Im Lo Sishma...v'Ein Koneh".