Inheriting a Relationship

This is a copy of my father's semicha [1]from Reb Aharon that was very rarely seen in writing(?). Among the things he says is that asher makir ani osoi haitaiv - I know him very well, mimai ulomoi - from his youth. Asher hitztayain b’kishroniosov v’shehitzliach b’limud v’naleh  b’bikiyus v’charifus she’ain l’sha’air[2] - who excelled with his innate abilities and succeeded in learning and ascended in attaining a breadth of knowledge and acuity beyond estimation.

He knew my father from the time my father was bar mitzvah and he (Reb Aharon) was 14.  My father came to Slabodka in 1906 or some time shortly afterward. He came from Malch[3], where Reb Shimon Shkop was Rosh Yeshiva.

When I came to Lakewood, the first thing that Reb Aharon told me was, “I remember when your father came to Slabodka.” That was one of the first conversations we had. “I remember when your father came to Slabodka.” That was like his “Shalom Aleichem.”

My father was close with Reb Aharon all the years, especially after he came to America. And you see this sefer was written in 1936. My father was in America when Reb Aharon came to collect funds in America.

My father brought me to Reb Aharon for the first time when I was nine years old. He used to bring me very frequently, and my father had a constant relationship with him. As I told you on the phone, he used to call me to get me to ask Reb Aharon shailos. So I sort of yarshened the relationship with him.

When I came into Lakewood, he had already known me from before, and he had already spoken to my father about my coming to Lakewood. So when I went there, I had a foot up on the whole situation.

I came from Philadelphia where I had been for three years, and before that I had been in Chaim Berlin. Rabbi Schwartzman, his son-in-law was the Rosh Yeshiva in Philadelphia at the time.

 

Links to History

Reb Aharon told me everything I know from the Gaon. Reb Aharon was a very big expert in stories of the Gaon and hanhagos of the Gra. He said to me privately, “Everything I know from the Gra, I was myself mekabel from the lashon used by the Chofetz Chaim.”

I’m telling you about them, and I wish I could find it inside here. Maybe I’ll find it while I’m talking to you.

He said, “Everything I know, I was personally mekabel from the Chofetz Chaim.”

So it wasn’t just that he saw it in a sefer or something like that.

The Chofetz Chaim himself came to Vilna as a bochur of 17, and I believe he said it was 47 years after the petirah of the Gra. Reb Aharon himself checked out every one of these facts, either first person, by the person who saw it, or by people who heard it from people who saw it, but not further than that. In order for it to be authentic, it has to be that way.

When I started collecting material on Reb Aharon, I followed the same process that I heard from him. First person, or a person who heard it from that person, but not further than that. Even a person who is not first person is already suspect. Materials that were second person were already mistaken.

I added another thing. Not only first person, but the person must not be an ??. He has to love the truth.

I want to tell you something about stories. They have to be exact. People made up things that happened. Or sometimes, they tell a story and I’m sure it happened, but they add things. For example, once someone was driving Reb Aharon and Reb Aharon told him he should go to the guy who’s collecting the tolls, not to go through the automatic lane. I drove him many, many times, and he didn’t go to the guy with the tolls. So when you’re telling over something, it’s true he said it that time. When I drove Reb Aharon, he was always holding a sefer. So when he said it this time, it happened to be that he said it this time and he gave this reason for it, but it wasn’t a shittah that you b’davka have to do this. You know, I mean, U’chodomos[4]. When you’re telling over a story, you’re looking for things that are characteristic much more than things that are uncharacteristic.

 

Bein Adam L’Chaveiro

He was a good person, he was a bein adam l’chaveiro person. Gevaldig. He couldn’t understand certain European Rosh Yeshivas who shall remain nameless, how they used to treat the talmidim with a great roughness. He was like a father to his talmidim.

And there were others who when asked for two zlotys efsher[5], would tell the talmid, “You’re asking for the emes? You really need five. So here’s two and a half.”

The Rosh Yeshiva also didn’t have the money to give davka. But that’s the way they treated the bochurim. Reb Aharon couldn’t tolerate that.

 

Learning Fast vs. Learning with the Olam

Reb Aharon spoke in many, many schmuzin. He demanded the Yeshiva should learn fast. The olam should learn fast. They should learn fast. I got set up with a chavrusa once, that the first day I started with him, and the second day I came back, he had already spent the second seder in learning further. He was holding a blatt further, so that was the end of the chavrusa. This fellow – a very bright fellow – went in to the Rosh Yeshiva, and the Rosh Yeshiva asked him where he’s holding. He was holding very far.

So he said, “Why are you holding so far?”

He said, “The Rosh Yeshiva said we should learn fast.”

The Rosh Yeshiva said to him, “Men darf lernen mit an olam[6]”. He meant that the olam should learn fast, but not that a person individually should learn fast. That’s an amazing vort. It’s important to know that because he always demanded learning fast, but he knew also that the person has to be with an olam to get anywhere.

 

Going to St. Louis

I’ve told over many times, and I’ve even printed the story, but you should have it as well. We had set up a chaburah in Lakewood. Our olam set up a chaburah to learn Mesechtas Makos,[7] We learned Kodshin[8] and other things. So now we learned Mesechtas Makos. So I was in the chaburah, and I had chavrusas and everything, and we had a corner in the bais medrash to learn. It was our corner. And we just sat down to learn, and I got a tap on my shoulder that the Rosh Yeshiva wanted to see me.

I went into the office. He said, “I need you to go to St. Louis, to go away for two weeks, to collect money for our campaign.  You will go with a certain yungerman.” I was just a bochur so he told me I would go with that yungerman, to collect in St. Louis.

I knew that meant that I would lose my chavrusas, I’d lose the chaburah, I’d lose the mesechta, and I’d lose the whole thing. It was mamesh the beginning of the zman.

I felt very bad. I went back to the bais medrash and sat down. I was down in the dumps, and my friends asked me, “What’s the matter?”

And I said, “The Rosh Yeshiva is sending me to St. Louis.”

They said, “You don’t have to go! You’re not a yungerman taking money from a kollel! You’re a bochur. What do you need – a couple of potatoes for supper here? What do you need to go for? Tell the Rosh Yeshiva you can’t go. We’ve gotta learn.”

Everybody agreed I should tell the Rosh Yeshiva. Everybody’s a gibor when it comes to somebody else. Somebody else should go confront the Rosh Yeshiva.

Later, he called me in a second time to tell me more details. So I said, “I want to ask the Rosh Yeshiva. I was just thinking to myself, more for my own information, my own understanding. I’m just a bochur in yeshiva. I’m not a yungerman. I was wondering, vos bin ich mechuyav tzu tun[9]? I just want to know. I’m asking for myself, far zich, vos bin ich mechyuav tzu tun.[10]”

I just asked for myself, oichet a chutzpah[11] but I asked him.

So he looked at me for a long moment, and then, “Ir veist far vos ir zeint mechuyav[12]?”

I think I learned more from that one statement than I learned from the entire mesechta. That said a lot of things to me.

B’chlal, he was very – he was mechuyav to do what you can. Of course he was realistic. He was very realistic. He was not a fantazor [13]by any means. He was surrounded by fantazorim, but he was not a fantazor himself.

 

A Telegram Before Yom Kippur

He used to use me for many things that he wrote in English. He called me, “Ir zent mein Englishman, mein Englishman.[14].”

One Erev Yom Kippur, he asked me to send a telegram to a certain – I don’t want to give his name – to a certain Rov in America, a very prominent Rov.

The telegram said as follows: “Hareini moichel l’kvodo mechila gemura v’im mar haselichah. Gmar chasima tova.”[15]

Those are the words he asked me to transliterate into English.

He told me where to get the address, where to send it to. In those days, they sent telegrams.

I remembered this and I wrote this down again in Cheshvan Tof-Shin-Chaf-Zayin[16],1967.

And this is the lashon: “Hareini moichel l’chvodo mechila gemura v’im mar haselichah. Gmar chasima tova.” That was the lashon.

So I said to the Rosh Yeshiva “Rosh Yeshiva, efsher zul mir nisht tzurikshiken aza lashon”[17].

Right away, the person sent him a telegram asking him mechila. This person was a public person. He was a handful, as everybody knew, and he asked mechila from the Rosh Yeshiva.

The Rosh Yeshiva wrote, “V’im mar haselicha[18].” So when he said, “V’im mar haselicha,” he was really saying, “And you should forgive me, too.”

So I said to him, “Rosh Yeshiva, ir zul nisht darfen shiken v’im mar haselicha[19]”.

So he said to me, “Ir zent gerecht, Ich zog eich tzu, ich hub em gornisht getun, un er hut mir bafalen, un mevayesh geven b’rabim[20].

He said it with a heat. “Ich zoch eich tzu, mevayesh geven b’rabim.[21]”

So I said, “Oib azoi, oichet mevayesh zein b’rabim[22], why does the Rosh Yeshiva have to be moichel?”

 

The Chofetz Chaim’s Death

When I told you, that he told me b’zeh halashon, ales vuz ich veis vegen de Gaon, hub ich alein gehert fun der Chofetz Chaim. Ven der Chofetz Chaim iz gekumen in Vilna er iz geven zibitzen yor alt, un es iz geven nur etlicher un fertzig yor,” I wrote etlicher, it was ziben un fertzig he said this at the time “noch the petirah fun der Gaon, un yeden maaseh hut er nuchgeforsht by der vus hut iz alein gezen, uder by der vos hot iz gehert fun der vos hut iz alein gezen. Uber nisht vaiter”. Kach leshono[23]. 

I told this over to somebody, and he said that it can’t be 47 years. He made a cheshbon how long the Chofetz Chaim lived and everything else. Recently, I found a clipping from among my clippings from The New York Times of September 16, 1933 in which there’s an obituary which says the Chofetz Chaim died and it says the family said that he was 105.

Reb Aharon obviously knew how old he was from the family. He was close to Reb Mendel. It was yadua. The family[MH1]  knew how old he was. There’s no shailah. That means he was not born in 1840. Because the history books say he lived until 95 years old. The family and The New York Times said it’s not true. Not that The New York Times is such a maven, but they got it from the family, and the family members said he was 105.

Nobody said his true age. Reb Aharon also didn’t tell his true age. I was with him in Chicago when somebody came over and wanted to give money in multiples of Reb Aharon’s age. So Reb Aharon said, “Oib azoi darf men zogen dem emes?[24]” And he told him his age.

 

The Electric Shaver

In my family, we never used electric shavers. Reb Aharon held against it. Reb Moshe was maikel, but Reb Aharon was very much against the kula.[25]

There was a Rov in Queens who used to (take a ?) [S2] an electric shaver. He used to give it away to the man, it cost him money. He was making $18.00 a week. It was his parnossa, and he gave his shaver away to a guy. 

Reb Aharon told him not to do it, not altz money. Reb Aharon told him not to do it because he held that it’s wrong to use an electric shaver.

 

Lakewood, a “Third-Class” Tzedaka

One time the Rosh Yeshiva called me over. He went to see a certain balabus for money. The balabus showed him a periodical that was put out by a certain shul in Manhattan which listed all the tzedakas. There were first, second, and third class tzedakas on the list. Lakewood was listed as a third-class tzedaka.

What was a first-class tzedaka? Rabbi Yitzchok Elchonon  was the first listed. Yeshiva Toras Emes in Boro Park was a first-class tzedaka. But Lakewood was a third-class tzedaka.

So the Rosh Yeshiva asked me to make an appointment with the Rov in Manhattan.  I was to go to see him and asked him either that he move Lakewood to a first-class tzedaka or remove it altogether from the list.

I made an appointment. I took the bus and the train, and I came to him. I sat down in the study and I told him Reb Aharon’s request.

And then I said, “Reb Aharon didn’t ask me to say this to you, but I’m saying it for myself. I just don’t understand how you could possibly consider Lakewood a third-class tzedaka.”

So the Rov said to me like this, “What’s going to be from the Litvishe pilpul? Gornisht. Chutch hut min a bissel Chassidishe varmkeit, epes andersht. Fun de litvishe vet gornisht zein. Nu, uber l’choved Reb Aharon vel ich arois nemen.  Volt geven a bissel Chassidus, a bissel varmkeit, but l’choved Reb Aharon, I’ll take it out.”[26]

I went back to yeshiva and I told the Rosh Yeshiva what the Rov said. “Vos vet zain fun die Litvishe pilpulim?”[27]

As soon as I said it, the Rosh Yeshiva started making a cheshbon. And then he said, “B’chlal, who has such talmidim like we have? He made a list of all the talmidim chashuvim in Lakewood.”

And they were chashuvim. The first one he mentioned was Reb Yosef Rosenblum. “Who has such talmidim like Reb Yosef Rosenblum?”

 

Discovering the Truth

Years later in Far Rockaway, I bumped into a Yid named Daniel Meyers. This Daniel Meyers was active in community things in those years. He told me an interesting story. In 1944, there was a meeting in Manhattan of all the Gedolim. It had to do with getting a train of people out of Hungary. There was a certain Rov there who said that a car should be set aside for the Munkatcher Rebbe, Reb Rabinowitz[MH3] , and his mishpacha, and that nobody else should go in the car.

Reb Aharon said to him, “Ir farshteit nisht az mir ret dur vegen nefashos?[28]” “Do you understand here we’re talking about saving human lives, and you want to have a separate car?”  And he said to him, “Un ir farshteit nisht vos dos ment a Rebbe far Chassidim[29].”

This he said to Reb Aharon. He got up and walked out.

That guy was this Rov. But Daniel Meyers didn’t know the story about the rating as “third class tzedaka.”

It’s interesting. The man carried a grudge from 1944 all the way through till this story took place, which was in the 60’s.

 

Halachic Inyanim

He was against early marriages.

He said you can use safety pins on Shabbos, which is in the sefer. Somebody says not. But he permitted safety pins on Shabbos.[MH4] 

 

What a Bochur Should Learn

In Lakewood, I was very deeply immersed in seforim of the Maharal. Reb Aharon complained about it to my father. “Lo zu haderech.[30]” He was very much opposed to it. Just learning Gemara. No Maharal. And I saw he himself carrying a Maharal sefer. He used to carry a Mishnah Berurah very frequently in the later years, but he carried a Maharal sefer when I was there.

 

The Shailah about the Coffee Urn

The Rosh Yeshiva after he finished a course, would ask the person being meshamesh him, which was in my time was very often myself, for “a gluz tei”.[31]

There was a large urn. It was screwed into the counter. And there was a flame. They waited for the Rosh Yeshiva to ask for a gloz of tei. They asked him a shailah how the Mishneh Berurah brings down on Sefer Hilchos Bishul[32] from the Sefer Chomos Yerushalayim, a Yerushalmi that you can’t take out a food from a keili on Shabbos that’s attached to a fire because it might break.

So there’s a gezeira maybe you will put the food back in. If you put the food in, it will come to bishul. Then you can’t take it out at all because then you’ll take out all of it. Choshesh for the keilim. So they asked this shailah. The Mishnah Berurah brings it down. They waited for him to ask for tea, and then they asked this question.

So the Rosh Yeshiva said like this. He said, “All over Rusland, they used samovarin that had coals in them. So how come they didn’t do that? What does the Rambam bring?” First he said, “Why doesn’t the Rambam bring it?” And then he said, “I remember Reb Isser Zalman used to ask that kasha always. Why didn’t the Rambam bring it?” And then he said, “In all of Russia, they all used samovarin, and nobody ever was moche on it. What’s the teretz? The teretz is that you can ask a kasha when he puts in the food to say that the keili is a melacha sheiena tzricha legufo[33]. He doesn’t want to save it to cook the food. He wants to save the keili.

The Yerushalmi goes l’shittasoi he holds melacha sheinia tzricha legufo is chayav. We hold melacha sheiina legufo is patur so therefore it’s a gezeira legezeira and m’meilah its muttar.[34]

A glass of tea.

In the tube, the glass tube, it showed the level of water which was cool, so when you lower it, it goes down. So that I didn’t know how to cope with, and he didn’t have tea that Shabbos. But I just want to tell you that I spoke to scientists, and they all say that the water has already exchanged from the water inside.

 

A European Approach to Halacha and Minhag

In general, that’s what he used to do. He used to fall back on the customs of the past. We’re living in a country that has no past. It’s a new world, and our past has been lost. An ancestor is a person who has a past. It’s very chashuv to those who have a past. It was their morah derech for the future.

The niluk of the past was considered to be correct unless you had some raya fakert[35]. In those areas where Reb Aharon had a raya fakert or had a shtickel Torah or something else, he was a machmir. In areas where there was no raya fakert, he could not tolerate people changing things, even if it said so in Mishnah Berurah.

He wasn’t the only one that was that way. Reb Yankev was that way. My father was that way. I mean, this is what the old generation was. Reb Moshe, I think, couldn’t tolerate chiddushim. Vos iz geven, freier is geven shlecht?[36] Unless, there was some siba to be mechadesh. A person could have a personal chumrah if he wanted to add to it perhaps. He was not against that. He was against the olam being osek in frumkeit instead of in learning.

He wanted the olam to be araingutun only in learning. Only learning. They shouldn’t have a side interest. They shouldn’t be distracted from learning in side interests, such as frumkeit, or machshava, or other things. I know he meant it for everybody all his life, but he meant it for young boys who were holding by learning. He held they mamesh had to learn, learn, learn, and have no interest, no chiyus, no geshmak except in learning.

 

Reb Aharon and The Brisker Derech

I’m really astonished when I hear certain individuals say that Reb Aharon’s derech in learning was like the Brisker derech. It was not Brisker. Anyone who was in the shiur who has any brains at all cannot say that Reb Aharon was a Brisker. His style was altogether different. His style was binyan, and he told me personally that a svorah, you could say this way or that way, but you never know the truth. If you have a raya, then you know where you’re going. Then you know what the truth is. If you have a cheshbon and it fits together, then you know it’s true. But a svorah you can say any way you want. Svoras don’t mean anything. He was very much against stam saying svoras.

The Brisker way is a lot of saying svoras. Saying svoras this way, saying svoras that way. He was very much against that style. He wanted people to learn and to know and he just didn’t believe in it.

I once asked him when they were selling Reb Boruch Ber. I was very enamored with the sefer. You couldn’t get it at that time. Seforim were hard to come by. Now there’s a tremendous abundance of seforim.

But with that sefer, there was a shailah that the people who had originally printed it claimed that the new printer had no right to print it. But it was being sold and I asked the Rosh Yeshiva if I was allowed to buy it.

The Rosh Yeshiva said, “Yes, you’re allowed to buy it.” But he also said, “You shouldn’t look at it until after 11:00 at night.”

He held that you have to learn the Gemara, Rashi, the Rishonim, whatever you should learn, and listen to the shiurim, and that’s it. You want it? Look at it 11:00 at night. You want to look at another sefer? Okay. But basically, that’s what he held, and whoever told you otherwise, it’s just a story ??. No question about it.

 

Frumma Shailos

The Rosh Yeshiva – whenever they asked him these kinds of frumma shailos to him, he was very upset by it. He didn’t like the frumma shailos. And he’d give a quote of the past.

We had a lot of shailos on sardines in our times. So I asked the Rosh Yeshiva if we could eat sardines.

The Rosh Yeshiva said, “Alleh Gedolim huben ge’essen sardines. The Chofetz Chaim hut ge’essen sardines, Reb Chaim Ozer hut ge’essen sardines…and and and[37].”

He said it in a second. He spoke like a machine gun. He gave a list of all the people he knew who ate sardines. “Vos macht men naya shailos? Dus is business massen, business massen[38].”

He held it was all fake. It was frequently fake, and then when I would ask him, “But l’maaseh, vos zul men ton?[39]”

He’d say, “L’maaseh ver ken vissen?[40]”

But it upset him very much because he held that it was mostly fakerei. And you want to know something? It mostly is fakerei. Sardines, a shailah? Most of this stuff is not true, but the fact is that Yidden muzen machen a leben[41].

He couldn’t take it. He was a man of truth. He couldn’t take this. He couldn’t be cynical enough to laugh at it.

A gevaldigge maaleh that he had, as a Rebbe, [MH5] that he used to tell over maasehs to the talmidim very frequently. Very frequently he’d tell over maasehs. He’d tell over to a group of talmidim, but to individual talmidim, he shared with them many, many things. And it was a very big chinnuch for them because unfortunately, big shailos had arisen over things that they had to decide, and he shared with talmidim all the time gevaldigge maasehs.

 

Disruptions by Phone

I once drove him home and the phone rang. I was in the kitchen at that moment and there was an extension to the other room. So I grabbed it off the cradle and I said, “Just a minute please.” Unfortunately, he had heard the beginning of the ring, and he said, “Ver iz dos?[42]”

I asked the Rosh Yeshiva, “Maybe the Rosh Yeshiva will first wash and make hamotzi and eat a k’zayis. He didn’t eat big k’zaisim b’chlal. He didn’t eat the Chazon Ish k’zaysim[43]. But he ate a k’zayis before he was mafsik. So I knew he’d get at least a k’zayis. He had a little soup with it also once he was taking a k’zayis, a dry piece of bread.

So maybe the Rosh Yeshiva will wash first and then take the phone, and the person on the line vet varten a minut[44]. But, the Rosh Yeshiva went over to the phone right away, and he talked with the person. He sat down in his seat. The food was sitting in front of him. He didn’t touch it. He was exhausted. He hadn’t eaten all day long.

And he stayed on that phone maybe half an hour, and the person on the other end was talking to him and talking to him. The Rosh Yeshiva said, “Yah. Ich vais. Ich farshtay.[45]”

There was nothing in maaseh bereishis and maaseh merkava[46] that he didn’t know within three minutes. And surely not a piece of politics that the guy was telling him. But he knew the person had to be listened to.

He was an impatient person, Reb Aharon. He didn’t waste a minute. But then he said, “Ich hob eich oisgehert, m’techilla v’ad sof. Yetz kent ir mir heren vus ich vel eich zugen.[47]”

He gave me a little humorous glance. He realized he’d lost half an hour by listening to that person from techilla v’ad sof[48]. Mel zul farshteien[49], so, he gave me a little look, a little wink.

That was his patience. Amazing patience that he had. Such a limud zchus[50].

 

Two Ordinary Women

And you see, I have several notebooks like this, full of things I have in first person. This section is on Reb Aharon. But this is from other gedolim I was zoche to hear. Everything is down here in schvartz un vais[51]. Everything I asked Reb Moshe, every psak halacha I have down here. I gave Reb Kaminetzky’s son Nosson, who wrote the biography, I gave him a lot of material. I didn’t show up in the Reb Nosson book, in the new book on Reb Yankev, but some material I gave him. I gave him whatever I had.

Even ordinary people’s stories can make a difference. They’re very important. I write them down also. They’re irreplaceable, these stories.

I have a story about two women who came to ask a shailah. Lakewood used to be a resort area. Two vaibelach came in, you know, two old women nashim zekeinos[52] [MH6] . They were with uncovered heads and they had very short sleeves, little cap sleeves. They had put scarves over their shoulders. Amalege Yiddines[53] was not the same as it is today. Years ago, if ??. That generation is gone. No matter how frum they are, they don’t do it.

But anyway, they were people with uncovered heads, so I saw the Rosh Yeshiva was talking to them in the room. The Rosh Yeshiva was turning his head, glancing this way and that. He didn’t put up his beketshe in front of his face. He looked at them and looked away. But b’chlal he used to shuckle from side to side. That’s how he used to shuckle. So he did this instead of putting up his beketshe in front of his face.

I sat with him when I drove in the car to Manhattan on a number of occasions and at the crossings at the red light when the car stands and whole crowds of people would cross the road, the Rosh Yeshiva would sit with his eyes closed. 

 

Being a Zaidy

Once, standing by the crib of Isser Zalman, his grandson Isser Zalman Schwartzman, he was chuckling and saying, “Isser Zalman,what’s going to be with you? You have two mitzvos. Essen un schlaffen. Un du bist beider nisht mekayem![54]”

The baby started banging his head against the side of the crib. They didn’t have a bumper there. So he said, “Isser Zalman, a kup is far lernen, nisht far klappen.[55]”

He was a grandpa like anybody else. Is that a big chiddush? Epes, in the world, it’s a chiddush, veist ois[56].

Feeding a baby by Reb Schneur, feeding a baby himself. And making noises that the baby should laugh. A chiddush by them but I have experience with some of these stories.

 

On an Airplane with the Rosh Yeshiva

When the Rosh Yeshiva was in Chicago, it was at the chasunah of Hershhoff. I stayed by one family on North Hamlin. The Rosh Yeshiva stayed at the corner house by Kaplan. We had gone by car, I think, but the Rosh Yeshiva was going to go back by plane. And somebody asked me to go back with the Rosh Yeshiva on the plane.

I prepared a little box with tissue paper, and in that little box I put six pieces of strudel for the Rosh Yeshiva to have on the way. I was supposed to take care of the Rosh Yeshiva, so I took charge of the box and we went to the airport. When we got there, there was a long line. Somebody else was also with us and he thought the Rosh Yeshiva should get onto the plane before the line. He spoke to the airline staff to let him on earlier, and I remained in line. When I got on the plane, the Rosh Yeshiva was already seated and was talking to a stewardess. The stewardess was standing, trying to speak to him. She was standing with her arms out.

Things were very different in those days because they didn’t have reserved seats, so the Rosh Yeshiva had asked her for a seat in front of the cabin because he used to get airsick. In case he gets airsick.

The stewardess said, “No, over the wings is the most safest part.

[MH7] 

He told me that after World War II, the United States Army had flown him to Europe on a military plane, and he had gotten airsick. The co-pilot had gotten out of his seat and taken the Rosh Yeshiva to the front to sit him down in his own seat in the front of the plane.  He strapped him in there so he shouldn’t be airsick. So he thought the front of the plane was better, in front of the captain.

But the stewardess told him, “No. Over the wings is better.”

Later on, I mentioned it to the stewardess, so the stewardess said that when you see the horizon, it helps you also. But here you can’t see the horizon because the front is closed. So I sat over the wings with the Rosh Yeshiva.

 

The Strudel

In the pocket in front of me on the plane, I put the box with the strudel to give to the Rosh Yeshiva later. The Rosh Yeshiva was looking at a sefer. I think it was a Maharal, if I’m not mistaken. The plane took off and it seemed that I dozed off for an hour. I woke up and I saw it was time for the Rosh Yeshiva to take something to eat. He had trouble with his stomach. He ended up with stomach cancer. It was never recognized but he had trouble with his stomach.

I reached into the pocket and I opened up the box, and saw that there were only three pieces of strudel in it.

Should I call him a democrat? He treated everybody with derech eretz. Even the goyim, he treated with derech eretz.[MH8] 

I closed the box again. I was surprised the Rosh Yeshiva had gotten it. It was in my pocket, and he had managed to get it even though it wasn’t in front of him.

So he said, “Nemt einer[57].”

I said, “Nein, es iz far der Rosh Yeshiva[58].”

He said, “Ich hub shoin gehat. Nemt einer nemt nur einer[59].”

I said, “Der Rosh Yeshiva zul nemen shpeiter.”[60]

He said, “Shpeter vel ich shoin zein in New York vel ich shoin nisht darfen. Nemt einer[61].”

So I took one. The Rosh Yeshiva sat there with great triumph. He said, “Yetzt hut ir a safek k’zayis.[62]”

After I finished the second one, he said, “Yetzt nuch ales iz es nisht a sofek[63].” With a laugh. With a laugh.

 

What People Want to Hear

This story I can tell over, but people object to this story. They don’t want to hear stories like this. They want to hear kanois. I can tell you about that. But kanois the wrong way.

I saw him get into a car. On the car seat there was a Mishmeres Chomroseinu, a Neturei Karta paper He didn’t touch it with his hands, but altz gnei[MH9] , he pushed it with his elbow. He pushed it on the floor, and he said, “Feh! Alleh muktzas! Muktzah machmas issur, muktzah machmas miyus![64]”

He said it in g’nei[MH10] . In yeshiva they said over g’nei that the Satmar said “Ich bin nisht motzi a Tzionist in megilla[65].” He said over in g’nei.

That’s important. Nobody’s going to believe it.

I ask you, what can we do? They don’t want the truth anymore. What they want is a picture. What are we going to do about that? We can’t change them. 

Rabbi Beane: You give ‘em what you’ve got.

Rabbi Perr: No, but they’re not going to accept this. You see the world has locked itself in what it wants to be. They need that. Psychologists would say there’s a psychological need for it.

There’s no way that we can change that now. There are too many of them. They’ll accuse us of lying and they’ll be rodef us. I’ve had this accusation by people if I said anything that was not as  “gefil.”

I’ve put together a chibur of stories on Reb Aharon that left out all these things. I showed it to Reb Zelig Epstein. Do you know Reb Zelig?

Rabbi Beane: I don’t know him personally.

Rabbi Perr: Reb Zelig is from the ziknei zekeinim[66] that are left. He was very close with Reb Aharon.

“Gib iber in mein numen az ales is a hundred pertzent autzentish. Nisht mit de garbage vos mit gebt arois heint.  This is what he said, b’zeh halashon[67].

I said, “Should I publish it?

So he said “They’ll break your windows.”

So I said “Who, R’ Malkiel will break my windows?”

So he answered, “R’ Malkiel is going to break your windows? Somebody’s going to ask R’ Malkiel ‘Were you maskim to put this out?’ He’ll say ‘No,’ so they’ll come with stones and they’ll break your windows. What do you need it for?”