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Prepared by Rabbi P. Feldman
of Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Yerushalayim
Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld


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Bava Basra 80

BAVA BASRA 80 (28 Sivan) - dedicated to the memory of Hagaon Rav Yisroel Zev [ben Rav Avrohom Tzvi] Gustman ZT'L (author of "Kuntresei Shi'urim" and renowned Dayan of pre and post-war Vilna) on his Yahrzeit, by a number of students who merited to study under him: Harav Lazar Stern and Harav Zalman Stern of Brooklyn; Yechiel Wachtel and Michoel Star of Yerushalayim.

1) ONE WHO BUYS THE YIELD OF A DOVECOTE OR HIVE

(a) (Mishnah): If Reuven buys the offspring of Shimon's dovecote, Shimon retains the first litter of chicks (normally, a male and female);
(b) If he buys the offspring of Shimon's hive, he gets the first three litters of bees, (then) he (Shimon) is Mesares (this will be explained);
(c) If he buys the loaves of honey of the hive, Shimon retains two loaves (to sustain the bees in winter);
(d) If he buys the rights to cut Shimon's olive trees, he must leave Shimon two branches.
(e) (Gemara - Beraisa) Contradiction: Shimon retains the first two litters of chicks.
(f) Answer (Rav Kahana): Regarding the first litter (and every litter Shimon is entitled to keep), Shimon retains its first litter (lest the new mother leave Shimon to be with its offspring);
1. Counting from the mother of the first litter, Shimon retains also its second (and third and fourth...) generation of firstborn litters.
(g) Question: Why does Shimon retain the first litter of the first litter? Just as the mother will remain on account of her offspring and her mate, the daughter will remain on account of her mother and her mate!
(h) Answer: A mother is insistent to remain by its offspring, offspring are not insistent to remain by their mother.
(i) (Mishnah): If he buys the offspring of Shimon's hive, he gets the first three litters of bees, (then) he is Mesares.
(j) Question: How does Shimon Mesares (sterilize the bees)?
(k) Answer #1 (Rav Yehudah): He gives them mustard to eat.
1. (R. Yosi b'Rebbi Chanina): This does not sterilize them; rather, the sharp taste causes them to eat their honey;
i. Once satiated, they do not reproduce, rather, they make honey (Rashbam; R. Chananel - in the holes (where they ate the honey) new bees will be born next year, they belong to Shimon).
(l) Answer #2 (R. Yochanan): Reuven is Mesares (alternates) when taking three litters, i.e. he gets the first, third and fifth.
(m) Answer #3 (Beraisa): Reuven takes the first three litters, after this he is Mesares, i.e. alternates, leaving every second litter for Shimon.
2) THE TUM'AH OF HONEY
(a) (Mishnah): If he buys the loaves of honey of the hive, Shimon retains two loaves.
(b) (Rav Kahana): Honey (even) in a hive is always considered food (i.e. receives Tum'ah, even though sometimes it is likely that the bees will eat it, unless he designated it for the bees; alternatively - honey is considered food only in its hive, but if it flows out, it receives Tum'ah like a drink, unless he explicitly planned to eat it).
(c) Inference: He holds that it receives Tum'ah even without intention (to eat it).
(d) Question (Beraisa): Honey in a hive is neither a food nor a drink.
(e) Answer #1 (Abaye): The Beraisa refers to the two loaves (that sustain the bees in winter).
(f) Answer #2 (Rava): The Beraisa is like R. Eliezer.
80b---------------------------------------80b

1. (Mishnah - R. Eliezer): A beehive is like land: we may write a Pruzbul if the borrower has a beehive, it cannot become Tamei in its place, one who takes honey from it on Shabbos (b'Shogeg) brings a Chatas;
2. Chachamim say, it is not like land: we may not write a Pruzbul unless the borrower has proper land, it can become Tamei in its place, one who takes honey from it on Shabbos is exempt.
i. (R. Elazar): R. Eliezer learns from "Va'Yitbol Osah b'Ya'aros ha'Devash": why are forests mentioned in connection with honey?
ii. Answer: Just as uprooting from a forest is a Melachah, also taking honey from a hive is a Melachah (because the Torah considers it attached; therefore, it does not receive Tum'ah).
(g) Question (Beraisa): Honey that flows from a hive is neither a food nor a drink.
1. This is not difficult for Abaye - the Beraisa refers to the two loaves;
i. Since they did not receive Tum'ah in the hive, they do not receive Tum'ah when they flow out (until he intends to eat them).
2. This is difficult for Rava!
(h) Answer #1 (Rav Zvid): The case is, it flowed onto a repulsive vessel (it is unlikely that a person will eat it).
(i) Answer #2 (Rav Acha bar Yakov): The case is, it flowed onto chips of wood (great toil would be needed to gather it to eat it).
(j) Question (Beraisa): Honey in a hive is neither a food nor a drink;
1. If he had intention to eat it, it receives Tum'ah like a food; if he had intention to drink it, it receives Tum'ah like a drink,
2. This is not difficult for Abaye - the Beraisa refers to the two loaves;
3. This is difficult for Rava!
(k) Answer: The Beraisa should say 'If he had intention to eat it, it does not receive Tum'ah like a food; if he had intention to drink it, it does not receive Tum'ah like a drink.
(l) Support (for Rav Kahana - Beraisa): Honey in a hive receives Tum'ah like a food, even without intention to eat it.
3) ONE WHO BUYS THE RIGHT TO CUT TREES
(a) (Mishnah): If he buys the rights to cut Shimon's olive trees, he must leave Shimon two branches.
(b) (Beraisa): One who buys a tree to cut, he must leave a Tefach (for the original owner, from which the tree will regenerate);
1. Regarding a virgin sycamore tree (it was never pruned), he must leave three Tefachim; for a (pruned) sycamore stump, he must leave two Tefachim;
2. Regarding reeds and vines, he must cut above the bulge (from which they branch out);
3. Regarding date trees and cedar trees, he digs and uproots the entire tree, for the stump will never grow back.
(c) Contradiction: A virgin sycamore does not need three Tefachim!
1. (Mishnah): One may not cut a virgin sycamore in Shemitah, for this promotes its growth;
2. R. Yehudah says, one may not cut it normally; either he leaves 10 Tefachim, or cuts the entire stump.
i. Inference: Cutting the entire stump is detrimental, leaving any amount is beneficial (it will grow back)!
(d) Answer (Abaye): Leaving three Tefachim is beneficial (it will grow back); cutting the entire stump is detrimental,
1. Leaving something less than three Tefachim is neither beneficial nor harmful;
i. Regarding Shemitah, we cut in a way that is harmful; regarding business, we cut in a beneficial way.
(e) (Beraisa): Regarding reeds and vines, he must cut above the bulge;
1. Regarding date trees and cedar trees, he digs and uproots the entire tree, for the stump will never grow back.
(f) Question: Is it really true that cedar stump will never grow back?!
1. Question (R. Chiya bar Lulaini): "Tzadik ka'Tamar Yifrrach k'Erez..." - why are Tzadikim compared to date and cedar trees?
2. Answer (R. Chiya): If it only mentioned cedar trees, one might have thought that Tzadikim do not yield fruits;
3. If it only mentioned date trees, one might have thought that Tzadikim do not regenerate (they die without righteous children; alternatively, if they fall, they do not get up).
(g) Answer: The Beraisa discusses different types of cedars, their stumps do not grow back.
1. (Rabah bar Rav Huna): There are 10 types of cedars: "Erez (cedar) Shitah (pine) va'Hadas (myrtle) v'Etz Shemen (balsam)...Berosh (box tree) Tidhar (teak?) u'S'ashur (?)";
2. Question: These are only seven!
3. Version #1 - Answer (Rav Dimi): There are also Alonim (pistachio), Almonim (oak) and Almugim (coral).
4. Version #2 - Answer (Rav Dimi): There are also Aronim (laurel), Armonim (chestnut) and Almugim.
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